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which is slightly hypocritical of me considering I've been an enabler for
I actually just got done mentioning this to Ni, but I feel like I haven't been fair to the mods by approaching just them with the tonal issues, as it's part of a game-wide issue, both from players and mods. In some ways, I think this is why the way Dragon does things rubs so many people the wrong way - he might have the tone of the show down pat, but since nobody else really has as solid of a grip about it, he still sticks out like a sore thumb, a tall poppy that needs to be cut so to speak.
Nemesis/Antithesis was kind of a hot mess for the reasons you mentioned as well as the criticisms levied toward Dragon - it basically felt like a long con perpetrated by Zetta and the princesses, or in a meta sense by Dragon and the mods, and I don't think a lot of us have gotten over that.
As I'd said to Ni privately, I think the issue is threefold. The elephant in the room, the problem that can't really be undone without gutting the game and starting anew, is that Ni's design for the setting is rife with horror in both the "cosmic" and "fridge" senses, because there's explanations for everything, you just may not want to hear them.
The second problem stems off of that: There's explanations for everything, and people keep digging. I think part of the plummet back into darkness honestly was the repeated dives into Calice's world, which just picked apart a small scratch further and further until it became a gaping hole.
But at the same time, the mods could have denied further dives at any time - after all, it's been proven that powers aren't always consistent, especially ones as nebulous as JA's and Dandy's. I think at the moment what we need to do is dial the explanations back into a drip feed, and worry less about "why are we here" and more on "what do we do now". All in all, I've always seen MLJ as a game about taking a tangled, messed up life, and making something beautiful out of it. That's partly, I think, why I have faith that this game can recover, because the meta-issues dovetail almost ironically well into the theme overall.
I think at the moment what we need to do is dial the explanations back into a drip feed, and worry less about "why are we here" and more on "what do we do now".
This might help the tone but at the same time some characters by nature cannot simply settle down and relax. Personally, I can't imagine that the entire cast can realistically stop asking questions and quit digging especially after they were successful uncovering information after diving into Calice and other such activities.
To me the tone of this game greatly resembles the Puella Magi Madoka Magica series. It opens on a friendly lighter-hearted setting but as time goes by it's revealed that there's a practically unbeatable force looming over the scenario with an iron clutch on those who entered. The best way I can think of to lighten the load of that setup is through humor. Not that Calice is a funny subject but I think that MLP-ifying cross-canon opponents and challenges the way all the offworlders have been pony-fied helps greatly.
I can think of several characters, including one that I play, that simply cannot be complicit in essentially being held "captive". They want to get out, either to go home or regain their original forms or they just don't like being prisoners, whatever the reason, they are inevitably going to want to dig for answers in a bid to figure out what's going on and how to solve it and get out.
I understand that the mods can control whether or not they actually find anything of use, but I feel as though completely cutting off the characters' abilities to find information they're looking for will just lead to a bunch of deeply frustrated characters (and possibly muns).
As a further suggestion, instead of more information on the why/how they're here since we've had a lot found out about that and recently too, and since that seems to be what most of the issues are stemming from with regards to the tone of the game, could we have characters discovering more about what they can do about their situation to either fight back or get out?
It was mentioned up-thread somewhere that each time the Elements of Harmony are activated it weakens Calice's hold. Is there a way for this knowledge to become known in-game, or something similar along those lines without breaking anything? A way to give the characters solid hope that what they are doing here is making a difference against Calice or the means to discover more ways to weaken her oppressive grip?
It was mentioned up-thread somewhere that each time the Elements of Harmony are activated it weakens Calice's hold. Is there a way for this knowledge to become known in-game, or something similar along those lines without breaking anything?
I think this is a great suggestion for helping the tone. If it comes to light that activating the Elements helps, it will in turn motivate characters to make a goal of learning more about the Elements. (Not too unlike Twilight's discoveries on friendship when you think about it.) In turn plots revolving around strengthening the Elements of Friendship will naturally be lighter-hearted and closer to MLP canon.
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mylittleooc2015-04-13 08:29 am
+0.5
I actually just got done mentioning this to Ni, but I feel like I haven't been fair to the mods by approaching just them with the tonal issues, as it's part of a game-wide issue, both from players and mods. In some ways, I think this is why the way Dragon does things rubs so many people the wrong way - he might have the tone of the show down pat, but since nobody else really has as solid of a grip about it, he still sticks out like a sore thumb, a tall poppy that needs to be cut so to speak.
Nemesis/Antithesis was kind of a hot mess for the reasons you mentioned as well as the criticisms levied toward Dragon - it basically felt like a long con perpetrated by Zetta and the princesses, or in a meta sense by Dragon and the mods, and I don't think a lot of us have gotten over that.
As I'd said to Ni privately, I think the issue is threefold. The elephant in the room, the problem that can't really be undone without gutting the game and starting anew, is that Ni's design for the setting is rife with horror in both the "cosmic" and "fridge" senses, because there's explanations for everything, you just may not want to hear them.
The second problem stems off of that: There's explanations for everything, and people keep digging. I think part of the plummet back into darkness honestly was the repeated dives into Calice's world, which just picked apart a small scratch further and further until it became a gaping hole.
But at the same time, the mods could have denied further dives at any time - after all, it's been proven that powers aren't always consistent, especially ones as nebulous as JA's and Dandy's. I think at the moment what we need to do is dial the explanations back into a drip feed, and worry less about "why are we here" and more on "what do we do now". All in all, I've always seen MLJ as a game about taking a tangled, messed up life, and making something beautiful out of it. That's partly, I think, why I have faith that this game can recover, because the meta-issues dovetail almost ironically well into the theme overall.
no subject
(Anonymous) 2015-04-18 06:36 am (UTC)(link)This might help the tone but at the same time some characters by nature cannot simply settle down and relax. Personally, I can't imagine that the entire cast can realistically stop asking questions and quit digging especially after they were successful uncovering information after diving into Calice and other such activities.
To me the tone of this game greatly resembles the Puella Magi Madoka Magica series. It opens on a friendly lighter-hearted setting but as time goes by it's revealed that there's a practically unbeatable force looming over the scenario with an iron clutch on those who entered.
The best way I can think of to lighten the load of that setup is through humor. Not that Calice is a funny subject but I think that MLP-ifying cross-canon opponents and challenges the way all the offworlders have been pony-fied helps greatly.
+1
(Anonymous) 2015-04-18 04:14 pm (UTC)(link)I understand that the mods can control whether or not they actually find anything of use, but I feel as though completely cutting off the characters' abilities to find information they're looking for will just lead to a bunch of deeply frustrated characters (and possibly muns).
As a further suggestion, instead of more information on the why/how they're here since we've had a lot found out about that and recently too, and since that seems to be what most of the issues are stemming from with regards to the tone of the game, could we have characters discovering more about what they can do about their situation to either fight back or get out?
It was mentioned up-thread somewhere that each time the Elements of Harmony are activated it weakens Calice's hold. Is there a way for this knowledge to become known in-game, or something similar along those lines without breaking anything? A way to give the characters solid hope that what they are doing here is making a difference against Calice or the means to discover more ways to weaken her oppressive grip?
no subject
(Anonymous) 2015-04-19 07:14 am (UTC)(link)I think this is a great suggestion for helping the tone. If it comes to light that activating the Elements helps, it will in turn motivate characters to make a goal of learning more about the Elements. (Not too unlike Twilight's discoveries on friendship when you think about it.) In turn plots revolving around strengthening the Elements of Friendship will naturally be lighter-hearted and closer to MLP canon.
no subject